Bowling for Columbine

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crimsonglowgurl
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Bowling for Columbine

Post by crimsonglowgurl » Apr 5th 2003, 3:13 am

I just saw Bowling for Columbine tonight. In case you havent heard of it, its a Michael Moore documentary obviously made after the Columbine shooting. Its very educational, and a tear jerker at the same time. It made me really proud to be Canadian, as they refer to Canadians in a positive view throughout and the documentary basically raises the question of why American has so many more shootings than Canada (11,000 : <200).
Anyways, it inclues interviews with Charlton Heston, Marilyn Manson, the two Columbine survivors etc. Its a must see!

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Post by lance » Apr 5th 2003, 4:58 pm

Crimsonglowgurl,

Thanks for bringing up this movie. I haven't seen it yet, but I have heard great things about it. Michael Moore makes great, great movies.

Have you every seen Canadian Bacon? Another brillantly funny, satirical film that swipes fun at several aspects of American society and policy.

Best,

Lance Man

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re:

Post by crimsonglowgurl » Apr 6th 2003, 2:05 am

Hey lance man! Now that you mention it, i havent seen Canadian Bacon , but i remember hearing good things about it! It will be my next rental. Thanks!!!

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Post by lance » Apr 6th 2003, 2:11 pm

crimsonglowgurl wrote:Hey lance man! Now that you mention it, i havent seen Canadian Bacon , but i remember hearing good things about it! It will be my next rental. Thanks!!!
You're welcome.

Best,

Lance Man

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Post by SanDeE* » Apr 7th 2003, 12:46 am

I've been wanting to see Bowling for Columbine for a while now, but I either never had enough time or money. I've enjoyed other Michael Moore films before, and I used to look at his website a lot. Anyone have a guess as to when BfC might be out on video?
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Post by fnordboy » Apr 7th 2003, 1:27 am

If memory serves it was supposed to be out this month but it got moved into TBA status. I don't think they have come up with a new date and I don't know (or dont remember) why it was chnaged to TBA.

And before anyone says it, this happened before he said what he said at the oscars, and actually i htink it was before the war started. No blatant conspiracies...yet ;)

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Post by mglenn » Apr 7th 2003, 11:17 am

Just to point out a differing point of view here are a few studieson Defensive Handgun Use. I recommend: Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun.

As well as The Seven Myths of Gun Control

As an aside I'll point out that a quick search will turn up more problems with BFC than I care to link to. But when confronted with them Michael says that comedy doesn't have to be all truthful.

Not trying to start anything just providing a little of the otherside of the argument. :oops:
"When I disagree with a rational man, I let reality be our final arbiter; if I am right, he will learn; if I am wrong, I will; one of us will win, but both will profit." - Ayn Rand

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Post by fnordboy » Apr 7th 2003, 2:29 pm

mglenn wrote: As an aside I'll point out that a quick search will turn up more problems with BFC than I care to link to. But when confronted with them Michael says that comedy doesn't have to be all truthful.

Not trying to start anything just providing a little of the otherside of the argument. :oops:
I may not be on your side much (politically or with cable :twisted: ) mglenn, but on the gun issue I am. That would be the ONLY reason for me to ever vote Rep., I think Dems are just a little too crazy with the gun issues.

I enjoy Michael Moore, and I think his films are very informative and atleast show a different side that you may or may not see all the time. I think he goes a little overboard at times, but I still enjoy his work.

You can not just let the people in power and the criminal (a difference?) have the guns.

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Post by andrewgd » Apr 7th 2003, 4:31 pm

I'm all for the right to own a gun. But I do have some caveats on that, both are touched on by Richard Poe's book:

Myth 6: We Should Treat Guns the Same Wyay We Treat Cars, Requiring Licenses for All Users
-and-
Myth 7: Reasonable Gun-Control Measures Are no Threat to Law-Abiding Gun Owners

I'd like to ask, how are these myths? I'd like to get an answer to that before I put out my views on these two. I'm definitely curious as to how these effect gun owners rights.

ps. just an observation: we're ok with citizens owning guns to defend themselves, but not other nations owning weapons (that our nation owns) to defend themselves. Just another example of our hypocritical nation.
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Post by JPP13 » Apr 7th 2003, 7:52 pm

Crimson,

I saw BfC, and found it dark, disturbing, provoking and brilliant. The NRA can say whatever they'd like, but whats filmed is whats filmed. No actors.

The scenes inside Colombine HS were among the most unforgettable (and not necessarily in a goof way) I've ever seen.

I particularly liked the way that Michael Moore ( an NRA member and former marksmen) admitted he didn't have an answer. Its not an anti-gun film, but a reflection of our culture.

Ever see Roger and Me? Genius.

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Post by fnordboy » Apr 8th 2003, 1:01 am

JPP13 wrote: Ever see Roger and Me? Genius.
I can't help but think of the "rabbit scene" whenever anyone mentions Roger & Me. :cry:

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Post by mglenn » Apr 8th 2003, 9:17 am

I'll just give you a very quick highlight of these myths, I won't claim to do them anywhere near the Justice that Poe does:

Myth 6: We Should Treat Guns the Same Way We Treat Cars, Requiring Licenses for All Users

The primary reason for this is that it sets up the government as a registration authority and every time that has happened it has been later used to confiscate the firearms.

Myth 7: First off reasonable is a very subjective term. Secondly and more important is that by definition criminals do not obey laws. So creating more laws for them to disobey is pointless. What happens is that you turn an otherwise law abiding citizen into a criminal.

But please check out the book as Poe does a far better job explaining this with historical background.
just an observation: we're ok with citizens owning guns to defend themselves, but not other nations owning weapons (that our nation owns) to defend themselves. Just another example of our hypocritical nation.
First off no one said Iraq could not have defensive weapons. The Missles and WMD's are not defensive in nature.

The logic you use makes the assumtion that the US has executed 12.5% of its population in the pass 30 years as well as invaded a near by country with the soul goal of control.

Now if you turn around and say that we are doing the same thing by invading Iraq you may as well stop reading because I have to assume that you hate bush and feel that he is invading for the oil. The argument makes no sence. If the US wanted the oil we would have taken it in 91'.

As it stands at this moment we have destroyed an terroist training camp that has tested positive for ricin, a chemical weapon. These terrorist are clearly linked to Al-Qaida through with high ranking members being part of both organizations.

We have located Chemical Weapons.

Thus justifing the liberation and forcible removal of the Baath Party.

But alass I am way off topic and don't wish to cause a flame war. I respect you opinion of being against the war. But I disagree that the US is being hypocritical.
"When I disagree with a rational man, I let reality be our final arbiter; if I am right, he will learn; if I am wrong, I will; one of us will win, but both will profit." - Ayn Rand

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thanks, seriously

Post by lance » Apr 8th 2003, 10:26 am

mglenn wrote:Just to point out a differing point of view here are a few studieson Defensive Handgun Use. I recommend: Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun.

As well as The Seven Myths of Gun Control

As an aside I'll point out that a quick search will turn up more problems with BFC than I care to link to. But when confronted with them Michael says that comedy doesn't have to be all truthful.

Not trying to start anything just providing a little of the otherside of the argument. :oops:
Mglenn,

I know that me and some of the other progressive politics types here at the forum occasionally drive you nuts. (My wife's side of the family is dominated by conservative Republicans and they tell me I drive them nuts). Thanks though for presenting a different perspective. Your insights and point of view are much appreciated.

Best,

Lance Man

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Post by mglenn » Apr 8th 2003, 11:19 am

Actually it doesn't drive me nuts... I like a good discussion. I would sit down and have a discussion on the topic and hear your side and have you hear mine... and we might get a little hot at each other... But I can let it go and still drink a beer with ya and have a good time.

Some people have issues doing that so I have to watch my step. I never intend to insult anyone... but alas I am good at it and sometimes do it without realizing how badly I am putting someone down because I'm a no bulls*$t kinda guy. After all I don't admire Patton, I use the avatar cause I know I can be alot like him!!! :twisted:
"When I disagree with a rational man, I let reality be our final arbiter; if I am right, he will learn; if I am wrong, I will; one of us will win, but both will profit." - Ayn Rand

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Post by andrewgd » Apr 8th 2003, 5:41 pm

mglenn wrote:I would sit down and have a discussion on the topic and hear your side and have you hear mine... and we might get a little hot at each other... But I can let it go and still drink a beer with ya and have a good time.
So lets move it here for a more appropriate thread:
http://www.mscl.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2359
:P
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