Discussion for Episode 12: Self Esteem

General discussion about the nineteen episodes of "My So-Called Life". Note: Our episode guide can be found here.
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Discussion for Episode 12: Self Esteem

Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 4:34 am

Welcome to our twelfth MSCL.com episode discussion!

If you haven't already done so, please read the info about the weekly discussions here.

I highly recommend reading the Angela's World essay that pertains to this episode.

Other threads related to Self Esteem that may be of interest are:
Patty's parents
Jordan and Angela
Abyssinia's last name
Jordan's first feelings for Angela
Self Esteem
recurring lines
Question about Jordan and Shane in Self Esteem


Some threads about recurring themes:
Angela, Rayanne, and Rickie
Patty and Graham suck
why do we love Graham
food
hair as a metaphor
the contradiction that we call Rayanne
the contradiction that we call Jordan
school
plaid
colors
baggage
math references (I couldn't resist throwing this in since much of this episode centers around geometry!)
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 5:43 am

There is so much going on in this episode that I had to keep pausing the DVD in order to take notes. Before I get started, YES, we know that there is a goof with the sweaters in this episode and the Buffalo Tom song when Angela and Jordan hold hands at the end of the episode is called "Late at Night." :D

I like the look that passes between Angela and Jordan in the hallway (while she is talking to Miss Lerner about going to geometry review) - they were just making out a few minutes ago and now they're glancing at each other in the hallway.

The conversation between Miss Chavatal and Miss Lerner about Mr. Katimski harkens back to Angela's comments about teachers having dignity and being human (in the Substitute).

Why does Rickie hate Mr. Katimsky so intently? It can't just be that Mr. Katmiski called him Enrique in class. Immediately after his first class with Mr. Katimski, Rickie tells Rayanne that he's transferring to another class, then goes on to say, "He acts like he's this really nice guy, when OBVIOUSLY he's not." What makes Rickie think that Mr. Katimski is anything but nice? I would hate to think that BF used this as an opportunity to turn Rickie into a total drama queen for the benefit of the "join drama club" plot, but the fact that Rickie later laments to Brian, "He's driving me stark, raving mad!" with a dramatic flourish leads me to believe that shy sweet Rickie abruptly became a drama queen in this episode.

I find it very disloyal that Rayanne runs off with a "see ya!" every time that Mr. Katimski approaches Rickie (three times in all). I understand that it doesn't involve her and she doesn't want to get in trouble when they are supposed to be at lunch, but it seems like she's hanging Rickie out to dry. Conversely, she is very loyal to Angela in this episode. She goes to Pike Street with her and then confronts Jordan about the way he has been treating Angela after she sees the way he hurt her.

How does Rickie know where Angela is? Did Angela tell him before she told Rayanne? The way he asks Rayanne, "So...guess where Angela is!" makes me think that she confided in him and no one else knows at that point.

Danielle's stellar moment in this episode is when she asks Graham what mediocrity is, then rolls her eyes when he tells her to look it up. That was always my mom's answer so I quit bothering to ask after a while.

In the discussion for Why Jordan Can't Read, we talked about the way Angela made a bigger deal out of her "relationship" with Jordan than anything we had seen of it. She does this again when she says, "We barely talked, and when we did, it came out sounding really meaningful." At least in this instance she says that it sounds really meaningful, rather than it is really meaningful. I suppose that's a baby step forward, but how meaningful is it when she tells Jordan, "There's a tiny leaf in your hair"? Like they say, you see what you want to see. She wants to see sentences like that when they come up for air as serious conversation.

The way he refers to her as "nobody" and "nothing" when Shane questions him is her first clue that he isn't exactly her boyfriend, but what a hurtful way to find out. I totally sympathize with her because there was a guy that I made out with in high school - we never went to a dance together or even to the movies. We just made out. A lot. Granted, we went to different high schools and neither of us had a car so the social possibilities were pretty limited, but it made me feel like crap. Years later we talked about it and he admitted that he had liked me but didn't know how to express himself except through his hormones (yup, words are hard when you're a teenager!) so he didn't know how to deal with the situation. Not a great answer, but at least he recognized how immature he had been.

Contrast this with Angela's opinion that "boys are less afraid of being wrong." While that applies to classroom situations (yes, there have been numerous studies on this!), I think it's less applicable to social situations. Jordan is afraid of admitting his feelings for Angela. He is also afraid of admitting to his friends that he is involved with someone outside of their social circle. Most of all, I think that he is afraid of putting himself in a situation where Angela can hurt him. So far he hasn't made himself vulnerable enough for her to do any damage, but this episode seems to be the turning point in their relationship (or the beginning of it - despite Angela learning about his reading disability in Why Jordan Can't Read, what occurred in that episode was Angela's perception of their relationship - Jordan, however, did not seem to view their relationship as different, meaning she was still in the category of Girls I Have Kissed in My Car). Jordan is afraid to make an outright choice by being with Angela because it might be viewed as "wrong" by his peers. Thankfully Rayanne's warning and his revelation in English class help him to realize his feelings for Angela and admit them in full view of the school.

In geometry, Miss Lerner says, "I'm not happy" to Angela and then tells Abyssinia, "Good job!" Maybe my school district had a different policy on student privacy, but teachers were not allowed to post grades with our names next to them. If they wanted to post grades, they had to come up with an alternate system (like giving us each a number). Similarly, they were not allowed to announce our grades to the class. Our teachers would not have been permitted to say obvious things like "Angela Chase, how do you expect to pass your midterm?" in front of the entire class.

I like the way that Angela still has her name spelled out on her bedroom mirror (I like that she has a visible vestige of childhood without having a bedroom like Sharon's), but what I really love is the way the N sticker is falling off and hanging at an angle.

When Angela says, "Hey, Ray, don't tell anyone, okay?" Rayanne replies, "That rhymed! Tell anyone what?" She either doesn't think that making out in the boiler room is a private thing OR doesn't think it's a big enough deal to tell anyone. I could almost see her thinking both even though they contradict each other. It's also possible that Rayanne didn't pick up on the connection between Angela talking about her frosted used lips and Angela's segueway to "don't tell anyone." When Angela clarifies what she's talking about, Rayanne immediately recognizes what is going on. Rayanne is very astute and sees what kind of position Angela has been put in. Very interesting that Rayanne sneaks out the backdoor, avoiding Patty and Chuck at the front door.

A carpentry question - what DO you do for a squeaky floorboard? :D

When Chuck asks where Graham is, Patty rolls her eyes and prepares for him to attack. Interesting that Patty assumes they need a marriage counselor to repair their relationship while Chuck's interest is monetary - Graham should be bringing home money even if he isn't the primary breadwinner in the family. Chuck's conclusion is this episode's theme: "You deserve better."

Ahhh, our introduction to Hallie. Notice that she immediately mentions (casually) that she has a fiance. Although we learn that she is just a Chatty Cathy who never shuts up, this interesting tidbit of information about being engaged seems like a sort of self-disclosure defense mechanism. Is she mentioning it as a "back off, I'm taken" kind of warning? Or a "I'm engaged which means someone loves me so I have worth" kind of thing? Hallie's brashness is a cover for her deep insecurity so I tend to think it's #2.

Graham comes home from his first cooking class and starts looking for the spicy mustard - hee! Rayanne's assessment rearing its head once again.

Patty does assume the worst about Graham's cooking class (similar to the Rosenfeld situation), but in all fairness Graham encourages her negativity with his evasiveness. If he had simply told her what happened (as he does later in bed), she wouldn't have made all kinds of pessimistic assumptions.

What does Jordan tap into his mouth (right before Shane talks to him about Buffalo Tom)? At first I thought they were breath mints, but he made such a terrible face - the kind little kids make when they are forced to take medicine - that it made me wonder.

When Angela asks Jordan about going to Buffalo Tom, as much as I want to hate him for being a jerk, he seems genuinely clueless about why she is asking. The expression on his face reminds me of when Rayanne tells him that Angela is French. He doesn't seem to be deliberately evasive - I think he really doesn't see that Angela wants to go with him.

In the hair thread, I wondered how Rayanne had time for her elaborate braids and hairdos and in this episode, we learn the answer - she ditches class and stays in the bathroom messing with her hair!

In previous episodes, we have seen Rayanne and Patty apply their lip balm. In this episode, we finally see Angela apply her much needed lip balm to her dry chapped overly kissed lips :D

Sharon says that the connection between Angela making out with Jordan and Rayanne's overdose is self-respect. Rayanne concurs with a high five - does this mean that Rayanne sees her drug habit as a result of her own low self esteem? If so, Miss Kryzanowski has done wonders with Rayanne in just a few short weeks of counseling!

I love the exchange between Rayanne and Sharon about hands as an errogenous zone!

Rayanne ends the scene by pulling Angela out of the bathroom saying, "I have to talk to you." Since they just discussed the most pressing matter - Jordan - what was so important? Did Rayanne just want to get away from Sharon?

Mr. Katimski seems more than just absent minded when he asks Rickie to join drama club then asks, "Did I talk to you? What did you say?" I guess he was distracted by all of the discussion about Rickie's name and his grandmother.
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 6:36 am

I absolutely love the conversation between Brian and Rickie - even though it seems like they aren't even listening to each other, they are. This is one of the first times we see them actually socializing with each other (as opposed to running into each other in the hallways) - no Angela, no Rayanne, no Sharon, just Brian and Rickie eating lunch together. Their friendship has been building slowly, from Rickie as one of the "intruders" invading Brian's house in Dancing in the Dark to Guns and Gossip where Brian asks Angela, "Am I supposed to get kicked out of school for protecting someone I don't even know?" In Strangers in the House, Brian tells Angela, "Your friend Rickie told me" that Sharon's dad was released from the hospital. By Halloween, Rickie feels comfortable enough in their casual relationship to ask Brian if he can borrow his clothes. In Life of Brian, Angela tells Brian, "Rickie's my friend," and Brian replies, "He's my friend too" (despite their brief awkward conversation about the dance earlier in that episode). Now we finally get to see the friendship developing between Rickie and Brian - the ever expanding karass!

On a similar level, Rayanne and Sharon take their friendship to a new level in this episode. Previously, they did not have conversations as much as they traded insults (or Rayanne asked nosy questions). Although they still deny that they have a relationship independent of Angela (as evidenced by their denial to Angela: "We don't discuss anything. We're barely even friends." "Are we friends?" "No!"), they are cultivating a friendship. At this point Angela is still their commonality, but the fact that the three of them go to Pike Street together is significant. In Why Jordan Can't Read, Kyle tells Sharon, "I thought you hated Rayanne Graf." She replies, "I do." Now she is appearing in public with Rayanne. I think it's great to see Rayanne and Sharon come together out of concern and support for Angela, but I also like that they at a point in their relationship where they are willing to be seen with each other (unlike Jordan who is not yet willing to be seen with Angela). Despite the fact that Sharon and Rayanne are still denying their friendship, their appearance at Pike Street is an unspoken admission of their relationship.

Hallie touches Graham for the first time while they are discussing Stephen Dieter's tasteless dish. She echoes the episode theme: "We deserve better."

When Hallie says that she will "make a big stink," Graham looks intrigued. Hmmmm.

Why is Graham surprised that Patty made new drapes? He knows that she can sew (since she makes the matching outfits for the annual mother daughter fashion show). Is this Graham's way of mirroring Patty's later surprise when he says that they want him to teach the cooking class?

Although Patty told Chuck that she "supports Graham 100%" in this new stage in his life, she is very doubtful about Graham's inability to follow the teacher. When Graham tells Patty that Stephen Dieter is a lush, is this because he really believes it to be true or because Hallie said so?

Rayanne gets Sharon and Angela into Pike Street by having them put their thumbs over the pictures - I wonder whose IDs (or fake IDs) they borrowed to get in. Angela's fake ID wouldn't do her any good unless she put her thumb over her birthdate. Maybe Rayanne let them borrow from her "collection" of fake IDs.

I found it interesting that Shane referred to Angela as "that weird girl." Given Rayanne's unique fashion sense and wild personality, Angela is positively tame, not weird. Then again, I think Shane has very different standards of weird than I do.

If my eyes don't deceive me, Sharon sports a tiny Rayanne-esque braid while at Pike Street!

Jordan does not try to defend himself when Rayanne reproaches him for his behavior. When she says, "You know you like her," he looks at her without saying a word. Is this because he knows he has done "an undefendable thing"? Or is he being his usual recalcitrant self? Rayanne then hammers in the episode theme when she says, "Would it kill you to admit it? Treat her half way decent? Because you know she deserves it."

I want to comment on Angela's use of the second person in her voiceovers but I think I have to go back and look at previous episodes first.

Angela laments Sunday nights as she lies on the couch not studying for her geometry midterm. I love when she says that Danielle's homework is "so simple a child could do it." Patty says that Graham is at cooking class. I found that a little strange - Sunday night is not usually when night classes are held. The first class was held on a non-Sunday night (the episode begins with Angela wearing a burgundy shirt with a plaid shirt over it - she makes out with Jordan, talks to Miss Lerner in the hallway, then comes home wearing the same outfit claiming that she was "studying for midterms" shortly after Graham tells Patty that he is "reviewing some terms for class tomorrow").

Rickie's crush on Jordan - I love the way he says that Angela's situation with Jordan (making out in the boiler room) is "so romantic" - Rickie still sees Jordan as another fantasy he will never see fulfilled, so he is living vicariously through Angela.

Another nitpick - we know that geometry review is fifth period and that Angela skips it to meet Jordan in the boiler room (every time I hear the phrase "boiler room" I think of Rodney in "Heathers"). Miss Lerner yells, "Angela Chase, why weren't you in geometry review?" then Miss Chavatal says, "Good morning" to Mr. Katimski.

This has been said before, but once again Brian and Angela argue inside the Chase house, yelling loud enough for everyone to hear. Maybe they just don't care if her parents and Danielle know what they are fighting about. Brian cracks me up with his line: "You have the option of insanity. I do not. And that drives me crazy!"

After what happened at Pike Street, why did Jordan leave Angella :wink: a note in her locker? Did he think they could pick up where they left off and pretend that Friday night never happened? Had he intended to apologize (before Angela got so assertive)? He doesn't attempt to defend himself when Angela attacks him. His only response is "So leave." Arrrgh!

When discussing the Shakespeare sonnet, Jordan has his revelation. He is almost able to answer Mr. Katimski's question about why the author is in love with the girl - after thinking about it, he opens his mouth to say something but Brian cuts in with his answer, "She's not just a fantasy. She's got, like, flaws. She's real" - a more sophisticated way of saying "like how she is." The irony that Angela has cut English to study for her geometry midterm and therefore misses this exchange entirely is such a pity. Then again, who knows if Jordan would have been able to express his sentiments with Angela sitting a few feet away from him?

Abysinnia echos Sharon's sentiment that she is sick of being a perfect little school girl. Abysinnia then says, "I haven't cut a midterm in a real long time." If she's such a good girl, why would she have ever cut a midterm? She also says that being a school girl "isn't worth it." Is she referring to hiding it from her boyfriend or the amount of work she has to put in?

Why does Rickie say he isn't "the sort of person who joins things"? Is this because of Rayanne's no football games/no school spirit mentality? Or because of Rickie's feeling that he doesn't fit? Despite Rayanne's general anti-establishment rebel type vibe, she seems genuinely excited that Rickie signed up for drama club. Earlier in the episode she didn't discourage him from doing it (unlike the way she practically forbade Rickie and Angela to go to the dance in Miss Chavatal's class).

Brian has a different picture in his locker at the end of this episode! He turns and looks at Angela with such a look of resolve on his face, similar to the one he had when he was telling himself to ask Delia to the dance. Was he going to march over and tell her something?

Although we haven't discussed Rayanne's oral fixation yet (which is why I'm surprised she didn't smoke), her constant snacking is an obvious sign. In this episode we see her eating a candy necklace (and sharing it with Rickie).

In the hallway, I like seeing that moment of integration when Angela, Sharon, and Rickie are going to the lockers and then Rayanne joins them. Although there is no dialogue, it appears that Angela's worlds are becoming more integrated.

The question has been raised in a previous thread whether Shane was encouraging Jordan at the end of this episode. Upon viewing the scene for the first time in months, I think so. He tilts his head towards Angela and smiles. Although he does make some questionable faces, his overall demeanor seems to be telling Jordan to go. I like that Jordan hesitates right before he reaches Angela, swallowing and glancing at Rayanne and Rickie. I also like the way Rayanne and Rickie tell Angela, "He's coming" then take a step back and practically do that "la di da, don't mind me, I'm not even here" kind of thing.

The reactions are telling - Rayanne is slightly cocky but supportive of Angela's actions (and decision to ditch geometry review again), Sharon seems concerned and a little disappointed, Shane takes it all in, Rickie leans his head against the locker and watches them wistfully, and poor Brian looks sad.
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Post by Nostradamus » Mar 31st 2003, 8:05 am

candygirl wrote:Why does Rickie hate Mr. Katimsky so intently? It can't just be that Mr. Katmiski called him Enrique in class. Immediately after his first class with Mr. Katimski, Rickie tells Rayanne that he's transferring to another class, then goes on to say, "He acts like he's this really nice guy, when OBVIOUSLY he's not." What makes Rickie think that Mr. Katimski is anything but nice? I would hate to think that BF used this as an opportunity to turn Rickie into a total drama queen for the benefit of the "join drama club" plot, but the fact that Rickie later laments to Brian, "He's driving me stark, raving mad!" with a dramatic flourish leads me to believe that shy sweet Rickie abruptly became a drama queen in this episode.
Mr. Katimsky did draw some unwanted attention to Rickie in front of the class, and his badgering regarding Drama Club tears him between his desire for expression and his fear of rejection. I don't doubt that Rickie's mannerisms were exaggerated for this episode, but his recent dance performance indicates he is not entirely averse to putting on a show.
If my eyes don't deceive me, Sharon sports a tiny Rayanne-esque braid while at Pike Street!
Call the tabloids! I saw it too! :P

Maybe I'm confused, since this was the first episode in a while I've watched on TV rather than a computer screen, but the characters do seem especially well-turned-out here. I suppose it happened gradually, but Sharon has come a long way from the kid in pink socks and sandals we see in the pilot! Angela's hair has faded nicely, and Rayanne sports a complex braid. The dull coat and hat over Rickie's bright clothes may be a metaphor of his life. Brian looks about as dorky as ever, though. :wink:

Quick question: What the hell was Hallie doing with her bag? At first she seems to be reaching for something, but does she ever pull anything out? Or is she so bored that she has to do something with her hands -- a manual fixation? :roll:
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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 4:38 pm

The first sighting of Angela and Jordan making out is kind of shocking. How do they get there? Their relationship seems to jump several rungs on the relationship ladder in a very short period of time. I know that TV must shorten time, but the effect is kind of jarring. I immediately get the impression that even though this is something Angela has wanted very much things are not going to go well. Even the setting, the boiler room, is kind of menacing and spirit sapping.

More later. Busy!
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Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 4:56 pm

Nostradamus wrote:What the hell was Hallie doing with her bag? At first she seems to be reaching for something, but does she ever pull anything out? Or is she so bored that she has to do something with her hands -- a manual fixation? :roll:
I thought that she was rummaging around for the breath mints that she offered to Graham and then quit looking because he declined.
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 5:09 pm

TomSpeed wrote:The first sighting of Angela and Jordan making out is kind of shocking. How do they get there? Their relationship seems to jump several rungs on the relationship ladder in a very short period of time. I know that TV must shorten time, but the effect is kind of jarring. I immediately get the impression that even though this is something Angela has wanted very much things are not going to go well.
This is another instance where BF leaves a big chunk of plot out and lets us wonder how they got there. I agree that although Angela has obsessed about being with Jordan, it's not an auspicious jump start to their "relationship." I totally feel her though - another story involving the guy that I mentioned earlier who I made out with in high school.

I had a crush on him for ages, but he always saw me as one of the guys (is this starting to sound like a crappy 80s movie yet?). When we finally hooked up, it was very sudden and unexpected. I initially thought it would be a step to becoming his girlfriend. Instead, that's all that happened - we made out but I never got any of the girlie benefits (Kyle might have looked like a jerk by the end of Life of Brian, but he did seem to treat Sharon like an Official Girlfriend from the very beginning, letting her wear his letterman's jacket, taking her out on dates, etc).

By the time I figured out that the "relationship" wasn't going anywhere, I was convinced even more so that I really liked this guy. As horrid as it sounds now, I was desperate enough that I was willing to take any attention I could get from him. And it's not like making out with him was unpleasant!

Things ended between us very similarly to the situation between Angela and Jordan - he wanted to have sex and I wasn't ready. After wrestling with the issue, both literally and figuratively, I ended it. Then he wrote me a heartbreaking note about how he realized he should have had better priorities, spent more time with me (he was a three sport athlete at his high school), etc. There was more heartfelt emotion and honesty in that short note than he had ever verbalized to me (but I'm pretty sure he didn't have Brian Krakow write it for him!).

As much as that made me feel like he could change and be good to me, I didn't want to go back down that road. He never slept with my best friend, but I think that going to different high schools 20 miles apart really cut down on having many friends in common.

I think that the jarring effect was intended by BF - because we don't see the transition between what had happened in previous episodes to what precipitated the make out sessions is a sign in itself that this might not be a long haul kind of thing that Angela hopes it will become.
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boiler room after Pike Street

Post by Lindsay » Mar 31st 2003, 5:24 pm

I'm pretty sure Jordon thought that if he left a note in Angela's locker to meet him, and she WENT that that would be his way of "making up." Like, because she was there she had forgiven him, and that because he left the note it showed he was into the boiler room sessions, which in turn ment he was into her. Good for Angela to voice concern!!!!

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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 5:53 pm

I really like how Brian and Rickie's friendship is developing, too. Having girls as friends is fine. But girls can't always be a guy's compadre or bud. Male bonding is important, even though it gets bum rap. Guys need other guys to use as touchstones. Both Brian and Rickie are in need of male friendship. The fact that they both know and have a great fondness for Angela probably goes a long way to explain the fact that they seem comfortable with each other. It would be so easy for Brian to treat Rickie unfairly because of their differences and vice versa. The scene on the steps when Rickie talks about Mr. Katimsky and Brian talks about Angela is a classic one. At first glance, it seems like they are totally out of synch with one another. However, Rickie has been paying attention and he seems to have a firm grasp on Brian's feelings for Angela. "So, you aren't going over [to Angela's]?" Rickie knows the answer already.
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Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 6:13 pm

I really don't understand Rickie's initial dislike of Mr. Katimsky either. You would think that Rickie would be the last person to get bent out shape by someone different from the norm. He always seem to be understanding of others. Rickie's outbursts seem to be unprovoked. I guess he needs to act out a bit so that Mr. Katimsky will notice his acting ability, but I agree with CG that Rickie's outbursts smacks of the diva or drama queen. It's interesting that Mr. Katimsky wants Rickie to be in the drama club because Rickie can act, but Rickie doesn't have a role in Our Town.
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Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
http://www.last.fm/user/TomSpeed/

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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Mar 31st 2003, 7:02 pm

TomSpeed wrote:I really don't understand Rickie's initial dislike of Mr. Katimsky either. You would think that Rickie would be the last person to get bent out shape by someone different from the norm.
This may be a classic case of criticizing in others what he dislikes most about himself - perhaps Rickie recognizes Mr. Katimski's personality as similar to his own on an unconscious level, which is why he resists joining the drama club for so long.
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Post by Nothingman » Mar 31st 2003, 7:55 pm

I don't think Rickie likes being called Enrique and being singled out in front of the class. I believe this is why he jokes about it as a defense mechanism. No one likes the fact that they are different pointed out, especially in high school. Rickie just wants to fit in, he does dress a little differently and he deserves credit for still being who is in spite of the pressure, but his desire to fit in is still very strong. Being called Enrique remindes himself and the rest of the class that he is different. I believe this is what sets Rickie off initially. In addition to this, the teachers that push us the hardest to excel and leave our comfort zone are often the ones we resent the most initially and appreciate the most in the end. As Mr. Katimsky pushes Rickie to do something outside of that comfort zone, it makes Rickie defensive. I believe that is the source of the dislike, not Mr Katimsky himself, his personality is just the easiest thing to attack. Kind of like Angela and Sharon in "the zit"; you point out my insecurities and I'll point out yours.
"To come to your senses, you must first go out of your mind." - Alan Watts

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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 9:22 pm

I guess Mr. Katimsky could equate to Mr. Racine. Both teachers seem to be different from average teachers. Rickie reacts to Mr. Katimsky in a much the same way that Brian reacts to Mr. Racine. However, after an initial rocky start, Rickie seems more willing to take part in what Mr. Katimsky has to offer.
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Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 10:07 pm

Does Hallie Lowenthal grate on anyone else's nerves like she does mine? I just don't like her. Of course, I'm probably letting the remainder of the series get to me. I just don't like her. Nothing too deep about this post. Sigh!
TomSpeed

Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
http://www.last.fm/user/TomSpeed/

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Post by TomSpeed » Mar 31st 2003, 10:49 pm

How does Rickie know where Angela is? Did Angela tell him before she told Rayanne? The way he asks Rayanne, "So...guess where Angela is!" makes me think that she confided in him and no one else knows at that point.
Rickie is very observant. He has probably seen Angela and Jordan enter the boiler room. Granted, Angela and Jordan probably enter a minute or so apart, but you wouldn't need to be Brian (AKA Brain) to figure out what's going on. Odds are that other people have noticed as well. That's why Jordan's desire to keep their making out a secret seems like a sham to me. If the boiler room is such a well known makeout spot, people probably watch to see who uses it. You couldn't can't have a more public secret place than the boiler room. Word would get around. Maybe Jordan hasn't thought things through.

What's so wrong with Angela anyway? Why would Jordan want to keep their "relationship" a secret? I'm not so sure that peer pressure fully explains what is going on.
TomSpeed

Patty: If Rayanne's not seeing you, and we're not seeing you, who is seeing you?
Graham: And how much of you?
Angela: Dad!
Graham: Oh, I'm sorry! I asked a question about your life, didn't I? Woah, what came over me?
http://www.last.fm/user/TomSpeed/

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