Discussion for Episode 3: Guns and Gossip

General discussion about the nineteen episodes of "My So-Called Life". Note: Our episode guide can be found here.
msclrules
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Post by msclrules » Apr 7th 2004, 3:43 pm

questions: is ricky the one that shot the gun in school? how do angela's parents react when they find out about the rumor about angela and jordan?

sorry to be asking this, i just never saw the show or read this thread! :D :D
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Natasha (candygirl)
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Apr 7th 2004, 4:52 pm

The discussion threads are really more for discussing the episodes than for asking about plot points. If you haven't seen the episode yet, you can read the transcript or the TWOP recap.
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Post by Guesty Girl » Apr 10th 2004, 7:35 pm

No offense, but I noticed that you never seem to be satisfid with what msclrules does. Quit picking on msclrules, what did msclrules ever do to you?

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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Apr 10th 2004, 8:57 pm

FYI - we can and do track IP addresses, so posting as a guest does not hide who you are from the moderators and administrators.

What has msclrules personally done to me? Nothing. What has msclrules done as a user? You have asked the same questions repeatedly despite being told where to find the answers on the forum as well as via PM. I am not "picking on" msclrules. I am telling you where to find the answers to your questions and you refuse to do the work of reading the episode transcripts, summaries, or discussion threads.

Saying, "sorry to be asking this, i just never saw the show or read this thread" is lazy and rude. I understand if you have never seen the show before since not everyone was old enough to see the show when it originally aired, but saying that you haven't read any of this thread is rude. In essence you are saying that you don't want to read what anyone else has taken the time to write, but you expect us to read what you write.

If you read through the information at the forum, you will see that we have provided links here so that users can find episode information quickly. In addition, the forum rules clearly state that you should use the search function before asking questions.

That said, this is a forum to discuss MSCL. If you have not seen all of the episodes yet, I have already pointed out links where you can find episode transcripts or episode summaries. If you had bothered to consult either of those sources or even read through this particular thread about the episode in question, you would find the answers you are looking for.
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Post by JPP13 » Apr 11th 2004, 10:17 pm

To put a more positive spin back on this thread, in reflection after watching every episode at least 3 times now, Guns and Gossip is still my favorite.

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Natasha (candygirl)
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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Apr 12th 2004, 2:25 am

It's really hard for me to choose a favorite episode because, MSCL groupie that I am :wink:, I love them all. I do think that this is a great episode - I love seeing Angela's relationships with Rickie and Jordan move forward.
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Post by Twizm » Jun 20th 2004, 11:27 pm

Regarding Jordan not knowing about the rumor, well I think it's true. I think Jordan just does not know about the rumor, and it ties in with the school dance in episode 11 ("Life of Brian"). People think Jordan doesn't go to school dances because they're not the cool thing to do, but he just never goes because he never knows there is one despite "500 posters up around school about it". So, for some reason he just never knows about things.

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Post by estherlo » Oct 6th 2006, 10:30 pm

I love seeing you guys talking abt Brian/Principal scenes. The plot reminds me much of like situations in Scent of a Woman where the principal pushes Charlie for offenders in a mischief agains him. Both Brian and Charlie, standing up to abused authority, deserve respects and admirations. It's from this very momont that I began to view Brian in a different way, from a timid boy infatuated with some neighbour girl to a man with thought and gut.

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Re: Discussion for Episode 3: Guns and Gossip

Post by majesty » Aug 4th 2008, 6:04 pm

Commentary:

-LOL @ Brian's "stomach trouble." Does he have some sort of condition?

-LOL @ "complete sex." I take it as a sign of teenagers to equate oral sex as not "real" sex, which is a cause for a lot of spreading STDs in that age group.

-LOL @ "introductory kisses." Which raises a question: What exactly did Angela report to Rayanne and Rickie about what happened in the car during Episode 2? From what Angela says here, and what Rayanne later says to Jordan about "how far [they] went," it seems like she didn't give the entire story. Was she embarrassed? Did she lie? I'm thinking she said something about the kisses, but didn't tell how they happened, or talk about her shoving Jordan, being called young and him opening the door to let her out. I wonder why.

-Of course Catalano is too cool to wear shorts in gym class. Or anywhere else.

-Whatever happened to Gina? Between her and Delia, Brian could have definitely gotten some girls during the school year.

-Mr. Foster's bow tie bothered me. Also his "what kind?" question about Brian going to the bathroom. I like how Brian handled him at the end.

-It's great continuity that Amber here mentions Rayanne wanting to be Angela, because it appears again in the "Betrayal" episode. It would seem like an easy answer to the question of why she slept with Jordan if it only came up in that episode, but they planted the seed way back in this one.

-I love Angela's reaction when her mother asks who Jordan is. Her expression and her response seem so natural.

-Rayanne in the counselor's office. I like her acting here, and good foreshadowing in the character's interest and ability to act which we again see in "Betrayal."

-When Rayanne threatens Brian ("You know what happens to snitches!"), do we see some boys standing against lockers showing Brian their fists? Did Rayanne tell them to beat up Brian if he did snitch?

-I like the scene where Patti talks to Angela about sex. Great acting. I love how Patti tries to enter the room all coolly, slightly bobbing her head to the music, lol. And I like how Angela hasn't had sex, "isn't even close... to an embarrassing degree."

-I love Angela's exchanges with Jordan in this episode, especially the second one. In the first exchange, Jordan really pisses me off, and I understand Angela's reaction. Her whole world was unravelling because her illusion of Jordan was coming undone. That exchange brought about the best line of the entire episode (and one of the best of the series): "It's such a lie that you should do what's in your heart. If we all did what was in our hearts, the world would grind to a halt."

The second exchange is my favorite because of the acting. He apologizes to her and tries to make up for everything, which I think mostly makes up for what he'd said. "Maybe other girls, but you're not like that." I think he respects her. But he apologizes in a manner that completely crushes Angela, and I love how you can see it all over her face even though she tries to act unaffected. I love that scene!

-Rayanne is crazy to crave rumors about herself. But it makes her character believable.

-I wish Angela had come out of the stall when Sharon was gossiping about her. But I appreciate Sharon's effort to defend her ("No, she's not a slut.") even though she's ruining her reputation by gossiping about her. She wants to hurt her by spreading the rumor, but not hurt her too badly. The conflict and loyalty in Angela and Sharon's relationship is well done.

-I love Brian's scene with Angela in the computer room. The way he puts his head down because he feels guilty about talking to Sharon. I've always wondered exactly what he told her. I don't think he intended for her to think Angela was really having sex in the car just so she could tell the whole school. Or perhaps he did say something about her making out with Jordan in the car (I can't believe he would actually tell her they'd had "complete sex") in the hopes of her confronting Angela about her behavior, and making her stop. Similar to what he'd done in the pilot when Angela was on her way to Let's Bolt.

I love that Angela is blind to see why Brian could have been hurt by her lying about going to his house.

-The end scene was well done. The metal detectors startled me the first time I saw the episode. The students' decision to protect Rickie had its consequences, and those detectors symbolize changes in public schools and the country. The episode was pre-Columbine and 9/11 when safety measures were raised. I went to jr. high and high school after Columbine and it changed the way school was. In addition to fire and tornado drills (I live in Texas), we also had safety drills about what to do in case someone came to school shooting guns.

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Cami A.
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Re: Discussion for Episode 3: Guns and Gossip

Post by Cami A. » Aug 4th 2008, 6:41 pm

majesty wrote: Was she embarrassed? Did she lie? I'm thinking she said something about the kisses, but didn't tell how they happened, or talk about her shoving Jordan, being called young and him opening the door to let her out. I wonder why.
Remember, Angela is new to the world that Rayanne is pulling her into. She doesn't know how to handle boys/sex but Rayanne pretends to be an old pro, so she doesn't want to embarrass herself in front of her all-knowing new pal. However, I think Angela underestimates how much Rayanne respects her and loves her already--we see signs of this respect later in the episode when Rayanne attacks Jordan about possibly starting the "complete sex" rumors. She's like an overprotective mother hen. I love that scene!
majesty wrote:Whatever happened to Gina?
Seriously, what happened to her? That is one of my favorite all time scenes, when Gina talks to Brian at the locker. "I have to leave the room when my father uses the electric knife!" Gina was such an oddling. And why is Sharon always trying to hook Brian up? What's that all about?
majesty wrote:Mr. Foster's bow tie bothered me. Also his "what kind?" question about Brian going to the bathroom.


Mr. Foster can eat my shorts! Least favorite character of all time! I hated him...
majesty wrote:It's great continuity that Amber here mentions Rayanne wanting to be Angela, because it appears again in the "Betrayal" episode. It would seem like an easy answer to the question of why she slept with Jordan if it only came up in that episode, but they planted the seed way back in this one.
Yes. This part is very clever. That's what's so great about this show! Winnie Holzman's writing and the actors acting truly captured the complexity of the characters' motivations and desires.
majesty wrote:The second exchange is my favorite because of the acting. He apologizes to her and tries to make up for everything, which I think mostly makes up for what he'd said. "Maybe other girls, but you're not like that." I think he respects her. But he apologizes in a manner that completely crushes Angela, and I love how you can see it all over her face even though she tries to act unaffected. I love that scene!
I think that's what made Angela different than any of the other girls Jordan "ummed" before her (like Cynthia Hargrove lol). Angela was the first one that made him think and struggle and grow. Although I think he was too dense to notice it, something kept drawing him back to her, even though she was far less experienced and far more complicated than all the other girls I assume would gladly be with him.
majesty wrote:Rayanne is crazy to crave rumors about herself. But it makes her character believable.
Also notice how right after Rayanne says how much she enjoys rumors, she sees cops walk into the principal's office and the smile wipes right off her face. The great thing about Rayanne's character is that she's a big faker. Half of what she says is bullshit. It's a cover for all of the messed up stuff she is dealing with (single mom who's never home, alcohol problems, numbness during sex etc...) and It's the person she wants to be. She enjoys making other people go--"Wow, she's cool! She's not got a care in the world"....but we see this contradicted on various occasions...especially when even her friendships begin to unravel!
majesty wrote:The conflict and loyalty in Angela and Sharon's relationship is well done.
True That!
majesty wrote:The episode was pre-Columbine and 9/11 when safety measures were raised. I went to jr. high and high school after Columbine and it changed the way school was. In addition to fire and tornado drills (I live in Texas), we also had safety drills about what to do in case someone came to school shooting guns.
I think I was in 8th grade when Columbine happened. I remember doing drills for shooter alerts. They had us get down and close the walls because shooters were likely to shoot through windows or something. I forget. That's the thing about all these scares like Columbine and 9/11...after a few years people totally forget about threats and go back to being carefree...It's sort of strange the way humans are built to adapt and forget. But then I'm glad we can because if not we'd be one depressed fearful bunch!
"So, the mouse makes pressure, just by breathing?...I can relate."

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Re: Discussion for Episode 3: Guns and Gossip

Post by majesty » Aug 4th 2008, 6:53 pm

And why is Sharon always trying to hook Brian up? What's that all about?
Hmm... probably because they are somewhat friends and she's aware that he's in love with Angela. She knows Angela takes advantage of him and is infatuated with Jordan, so I guess it's her way of helping him by trying to nudge him in the direction of other relationships that would likely be more fruitful.

Also, very good analysis of Rayanne's character.

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Cami A.
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Re: Discussion for Episode 3: Guns and Gossip

Post by Cami A. » Aug 4th 2008, 7:02 pm

Majesty,
That's probably true. But at times it seems to me like she's doing it more for the benefit of her nerdy girlfriends since she knows they have a chance with Brian--he's desperate and lonely.

Rayanne is definitely the most complex character on the show, which is why both me and ikilledkennyandjr are writing fanfics from her perspective. She's got a strong voice, and it's really entertaining to play around with her constant denial and expand on relationships that were only beginning to form in the series.

Is there a thread on here for analysis of Rayanne, Rickie, or Sharon? If not, that's a huge crime! LOL. You are definitely barreling through the show forum, huh? :D
"So, the mouse makes pressure, just by breathing?...I can relate."

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