Buffy the Vampire Slayer

Nostradamus · Post by **Nostradamus** » Jun 1st 2003, 6:28 pm

Yes, when you put it that way, I'm very glad Buffy got credit over Pauly!

bhayes1016 · Post by **bhayes1016** » Jun 1st 2003, 9:12 pm

candygirl wrote:
Wonder Buffy?
But Sarah Michelle Gellar? Yep, the U.K.'s Daily Record reports that the one-time vampire slayer is trying to squeeze into those skimpy hotpants.

Squeeze into? She weighs 80 pounds!

Buddy

lance · Post by **lance** » Jun 2nd 2003, 10:20 am

Jpp13 and Candygirl,

Wow, you guys put together a detailed, insightful discussion of Buffy's various merits and short comings.

I do think some of Sarah Michelle's fan base comes from the fact that she was the first slayer. The acting doesn't have to be glorious if you are the first. Some fans were critical of her performance in season 7 as lacking her normal vigor or passion.

I am one of those who does not pin Spike for ruining season 7. IMHO the biggest let down was the writing. Things just seemed to drift along. This was okay in Season 4 when the characters had left high school and were uncertain of themselves, they were supposed to drift until they could find out their niche. Some of us are still working on that by the way.

I am encouraged by Candy's post about Angel getting more good writers on board for Season 5. Can't wait.

Best,

Lance Man

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 2nd 2003, 2:12 pm

I think that you were kind to use the word "drift" - I thought it was disjointed and inconsistent. It felt like everyone was given an episode or two to write at the very beginning of the season and they all wrote them without knowing what other people's assignments were. Someone else said it felt like this season was written by people who had heard about the show but never bothered to watch it. Technically, we know that isn't true but it sure felt like it.

The other thing that bothered me were the crossover episodes. All season on BtVS, Willow has been reluctant to use magic because she is afraid she will lose control again. In general, she has been hesitant and meek. Then she shows up on Angel all perky, ready to use magic, and seeming like Willow from a previous season (circa S4, I would say). Then she goes back to Sunnydale and reverts back to her S7 self. Similar thing with Angel - he just joined an evil law firm and gave up his son, but he shows up in Sunnydale with the amulet, talking about its scrubbing bubbles and making jokes about Spike. Do the writers even remember the last few times that Angel and Buffy saw each other?!

I am glad that some of the BtVS writers are moving to AtS because some of them are excellent writers, but I think that because there will be some BtVS character appearances on AtS as well as the addition of the new writers, all of the writers need to sit down and watch EVERY SINGLE BtVS & AtS episode before they write a single word of next season. I know I'm asking a lot here, but a little consistency goes a loooooong way. You know it's bad when people are yelling, "She wouldn't say that!" at the tv.

I agree that part of SMG's fanbase is due to her role as the Slayer. Imagine the possibilities of what would be now if some of the actors considered for these parts had been able to commit or had been chosen:

Katie Holmes, Charisma Carpenter, Julie Benz, Elizabeth Anne Ellen (Amy the witch), or Selma Blair as Buffy
SMG or Bianca Lawson (Kendra) as Cordelia
James Marsters or Nate Fillion as Angel
Danny Strong as Xander
Riff Regan as Willow in the unaired pilot

lance · Post by **lance** » Jun 3rd 2003, 11:31 am

candygirl wrote:I think that you were kind to use the word "drift" - I thought it was disjointed and inconsistent. It felt like everyone was given an episode or two to write at the very beginning of the season and they all wrote them without knowing what other people's assignments were. Someone else said it felt like this season was written by people who had heard about the show but never bothered to watch it. Technically, we know that isn't true but it sure felt like it.

Yup, certainly felt that way.

The other thing that bothered me were the crossover episodes. All season on BtVS, Willow has been reluctant to use magic because she is afraid she will lose control again. In general, she has been hesitant and meek. Then she shows up on Angel all perky, ready to use magic, and seeming like Willow from a previous season (circa S4, I would say). Then she goes back to Sunnydale and reverts back to her S7 self. Similar thing with Angel - he just joined an evil law firm and gave up his son, but he shows up in Sunnydale with the amulet, talking about its scrubbing bubbles and making jokes about Spike. Do the writers even remember the last few times that Angel and Buffy saw each other?!

You noticed that too. Not only was she confidant with her magic on angel but she blew away evil Cordy's magic! I agree, with some series new writers, or returning writers, need to watch past episodes for the sake of continuity. Maybe Joss would make them take a test?

I know I'm asking a lot here, but a little consistency goes a loooooong way. You know it's bad when people are yelling, "She wouldn't say that!" at the tv.

Actually you are more than reasonable. Joss has made it his "trademark" of being responsive to his intelligent fan base. He can do better, and with only one show this fall, he should do better.

I agree that part of SMG's fanbase is due to her role as the Slayer. Imagine the possibilities of what would be now if some of the actors considered for these parts had been able to commit or had been chosen:

Katie Holmes, Charisma Carpenter, Julie Benz, Elizabeth Anne Ellen (Amy the witch), or Selma Blair as Buffy
SMG or Bianca Lawson (Kendra) as Cordelia
James Marsters or Nate Fillion as Angel
Danny Strong as Xander
Riff Regan as Willow in the unaired pilot

For me the big moment with regards to SMG came with episode when Buffy and Faith switched bodies. Like in the movie Face Off, both actresses where required to act for the other's role. SMG's portrayal of Faith was wooden and weak. ED portrayal of Buffie was dead on.

Best,

Lance Man

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 3rd 2003, 2:04 pm

I agree - the writers did a good job (obviously since they know how each character would talk) but SMG seemed like she was trying REALLY hard to imitate ED. Like I said, she has certain "modes" and this was her "bad girl" setting. Another example of her lame acting mode was when she was the Buffybot (which reminded me somewhat of her Faith imitation).

Kathryn of Cruel Intentions was a combination of the Buffybot and SMG as Faith - the "oooh I'm a bad girl" vibe plus that horrid clip they kept showing in the previews of her saying, "I'm aware" all perky. No wonder I hated that movie! I mean, besides the fact that the Glenn Close/John Malkovich/Michelle Pfieffer/Uma Thurman version was exponentially superior (and the book was even better than that).

And since we're talking about Dangerous Liaisons, there is a great quote that seems appropriate for the Spike/Buffy issue: "And it's not that I want to have you. All I want is to deserve you."

Damn, I'm going to have to go home and read that book again (although I have to admit I read it in college for a class, so I highlighted every quote that I liked which now makes it look like a bleeding rainbow).

fnordboy · Post by **fnordboy** » Jun 3rd 2003, 2:16 pm

candygirl wrote: No wonder I hated that movie! I mean, besides the fact that the Glenn Close/John Malkovich/Michelle Pfieffer/Uma Thurman version was exponentially superior (and the book was even better than that).

The Valmont "version" is better as well, though not as good as Dangerous Liasons. One of the two movies Fairuza Balk did before I started to hate her with a passion. The other one being Gas Food and Lodging.

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 3rd 2003, 2:18 pm

Hey, don't knock The Best Christmas Pageant Ever, a five star tv movie that Fairuza Balk did when she was a little girl!

fnordboy · Post by **fnordboy** » Jun 3rd 2003, 2:31 pm

candygirl wrote:Hey, don't knock The Best Christmas Pageant Ever, a five star tv movie that Fairuza Balk did when she was a little girl!

Eh and the Worst Witch...loved that too. But then again almost everythign with Tim Curry is good

lance · Post by **lance** » Jun 3rd 2003, 3:31 pm

fnordboy wrote:
candygirl wrote:Hey, don't knock The Best Christmas Pageant Ever, a five star tv movie that Fairuza Balk did when she was a little girl!

Eh and the Worst Witch...loved that too. But then again almost everythign with Tim Curry is good

Word. Tim Curry is the man. Ever see IT, that was great!

Best,

Lance Man

hurtstolookatyou · Post by **hurtstolookatyou** » Jun 3rd 2003, 5:32 pm

lance wrote: Word. Tim Curry is the man. Ever see IT, that was great!

Best,

Lance Man

It, as in Stephen King's It? A friend of mine played young Beverly. Also, Seth Green is listed as being in the movie, although i don't remember him...haven't seen it in years!

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 3rd 2003, 6:43 pm

Is that the scary movie with the clown?

True story - my senior year in high school, my friend and I were driving home from somewhere. Anyway, we were driving down Pacific Coast Highway - the particular section we were at is right next to the beach, nice and straight. There was a full moon shining on the water. And a guy dressed in a clown suit walking on the sidewalk at 1AM.

Luckily my friend was driving because I totally freaked out - we were both yelling, "Omigawd, did you see that? WTF?!"

We figured anyone out that late in a clown suit was probably trouble.

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 3rd 2003, 8:13 pm

Nostradamus wrote:Given the large amount of academic attention on Buffy, I wonder if any lexicographers have looked into this...

Actually a new book called Slayer Slang (with an intro by Jane Espenson) is being released this month. Sounds interesting! (how bad is it when my Amazon wishlist is comprised of items like this? OCD - bad!)

Book description from amazon:

In its seven years on television, Buffy the Vampire Slayer has earned critical acclaim and a massive cult following among teen viewers. One of the most distinguishing features of the program is the innovative way the show's writers play with language: fabricating new words, morphing existing ones, and throwing usage on its head. The result has been a strikingly resonant lexicon that reflects the power of both youth culture and television in the evolution of American slang. Using the show to illustrate how new slang is formed, transformed, and transmitted, Slayer Slang is one of those rare books that combines a serious explanation of a pop culture phenomena with an engrossing read for fans of the show, word geeks, and language professionals. Michael Adams begins his book with a synopsis of the program's history and a defense of ephemeral language. He then moves to the main body of the work: a detailed glossary of slayer slang, annotated with actual dialogue and recorded the style accepted by the American Dialect Society. The book concludes with a bibliography and a lengthy index, a guide to sources (novels based on the show, magazine articles about the show, and language culled from the official posting board) and an appendix of slang-making suffixes. Introduced by Jane Espenson, one of the show's most inventive writers (and herself a linguist), Slayer Slang offers a quintessential example of contemporary youth culture serving as a vehicle for slang. In the tradition of The Physics of Star Trek, Slayer Slang is one of those rare books that offers a serious examination a TV cult phenemenon appealing to fans and thinkers alike.

Nostradamus · Post by **Nostradamus** » Jun 3rd 2003, 8:49 pm

Wow, thanks for the info, I didn't know there was actually a book about it. I just enjoy using big words like "lexicographers" in a sentence.

Post by **Natasha (candygirl)** » Jun 4th 2003, 1:39 am

I am counting the days until the S4 DVDs come out bext week. Very strange since it is not my favorite season (by a long shot).

I was kind of hoping that this season's box art would feature the core four (not just Buffy and Willow).

If you look at the pattern of the previous BtVS covers, it's not that far-fetched:

S1 - just Buffy
S2 - Buffy and Angel
S3 - Buffy, Angel, and Faith

See where I'm going with this? I thought that S4 could be Buffy, Willow, Xander, and Giles (it seems so unfair that he gets left out of these things!). For S5, they could add Tara. For S6, they could take off Tara and add Dawn and Anya, then they could add Spike to S7. I know it's ridiculous that I have given this any thought whatsoever!

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