Trouble with your bank?

[starbug]

Hi everyone,

While most people seem to be getting refunds quite successfully from their credit card providers (at least from what I read here that's mainly the case), people who are forced to take on their banks rather than their credit card companies are having problems.

I was just responding to a PM and remembered a little story that I thought I'd share, just to reassure people that as a consumer, you have lots of power and you should not be afraid to stand up for your rights. If you don't have any rights, shout. It works.

Shortly before last Christmas, I was checking my bank statement, and I noticed a charge from BT (British Telecom) for £197 (that's around $300) which I knew nothing about. I always paid my bills by cheque, but remembered that a condition of being provided the phone service at the time of signing up was that I had to give them my bank account details. Like a fool, I did so.

I have since been told that this is NOT BT's policy at all and whoever asked for them was very definitely in the wrong. Anyway, BT cannot trace the payment, have no record of me ever owing them that amount. They recommended I speak to my bank and find out more info on the charge from them (like a reference number for the transaction). The Bank had a ref number but it didn't match anything that BT had ever heard of. Fishy. However, BT were unable to give me the money back and argued that the bank shouldn't have released the funds without proof from BT that they were authorised.

Long story short, I get into a row with the Bank. My point being that it was just before Christmas and I needed the money. I hadn't authorised the withdrawal, and the burden of proof was on them to show that I had done. They couldn't come up with anything, and said they would refund the money within 2 days. After 2 days there was no sign of my money, so I rang them again. The same woman then told me that unfortunately she had made a mistake and it was going to be 45 working days. I blew my lid. I was relying on that money for Presents and festivities. She then came out with the erroneous argument that the larger the amount, the longer it takes to refund. After I had explained to her that the policy was totally irrational (so if they take £5 without my permission, it really doesn't affect me too much but they can get it back to me within 2 days, but if it is £10,000 and I am left completely destitute with no way of eating, paying bills etc, they will take months to do it despite it being their mistake and leaving their customer with untold difficulties) and beyond ridiculous in any kind of customer service measure you care to use, they refunded my money. SAME DAY. I even got a call from someone high up to apologise.

I admit, I had to shout. I had to get rude. But believe me, if you've been an OK customer for a little while, they don't want to lose your custom and will do almost anything to keep it. It is a lie when they say they can't do it. 9 times out of 10, if it is within the law, they can.

Please please please, anyone out there having trouble with your bank, don't hesitate to use your consumer power, and please, have the guts to get tough with people. If you get no joy, escalate to the next level of management. Threaten to take your business elsewhere and write an explanatory letter to the CEO of the company. Do not take no for an answer. Their time limits are not a matter of law; they are purely policy based.

Good luck everybody!

[Tapp_Darden]

I Just got this in my email

We have received your disputed transaction in the total amount of $115.00.

However, the disputed transaction is older than the 60 day time period provided for reporting unauthorized charges and/or billing errors. Any potential credit must be negotiated directly with the merchant.

Thank you.

First Internet Bank of Indiana

PO Box 50310

Indianapolis, IN 46250-0310

Toll free phone: 1-888-873-3424

Toll free fax: 1-888-644-8678

Bank@FirstIB.com

http://www.firstib.com/

Anybody else use First Internet bank of indiana?

As for my I'm talking out my big guns..... My Mother.

[GaryEA]

Tapp,

You need to stress to your bank that there was no way thier 60 day rule could apply because the dispute is not just with the date you were charged, but the dates that AU said that the set would be released.

Because AU repeatedly changed the release date, making the 60 days rule almost worthless, and the fact that AU no longer responds to customers or banks regarding overcharges or refunds, your bank should put away the form letters and realise that you were erroneously charged by a merchant.

If they resist, get angry. We're talking about YOUR money, and because of AU's slippery methods, your bank is using the same methods to get out of refunding you.

Best of luck.

Gary

[starbug]

See if they have a policy on covering customers for internet fraud - that's how I made my bank refund me in the AU situation. I didn't realise it was fraud until way after the usual time limits, and why should I have? I always knew I was paying in advance for something I never expected to receive until a long way down the line.

And yeah, don't be afraid to get angry at them and let them know it.

[mrsoul]

You're actually disputing the charge because of non-receipt of the merchandise so the 60 day rule doesn't apply. I was successful in
getting a chargeback of the full $99.99 I was charged by faxing
documents to my credit card company showing that I ordered and
paid for the DVD's but they were never shipped and there was
a good chance that they would not be shipped.

You may need to talk to someone at your credit card company above the normal customer service. I was transferred to the claims division.

Just keep after them and don't take no for an answer!

[Spartacus]

Remember, you were charged for the Collectors Edition, and what you got is exactly the same as the regular edition.

To me, that seems to be similar to ordering new merchandise and getting refurbished. It is justification for cancelling an order.

[Tapp_Darden]

I also sent in documents proving that I paid for but never recieved MSCL.
Anyways I called my bank and all I got from them to do is to send in a compain letter(I forgot what she called it) to VISA. She said that it may not get my money back. She said that it would help if everybody asked there bank or card merchant to send a letter in on their behalf.

I didn't get angry at her. I did this for seval reasons.

when I was on the phones I hatted the people who got mad at me.

Its not their fault that I'm out $115. thats bettween me and AU.
I'm the dumbass for paying the full price on a pre-order. and AU is the dumbass for reasons we all know. And I will make them pay.... in loss revenue.....

Its a moral issue for me.

Now, if I can get VISA to give me my money back. great!.

[Howard]

And I will make them pay.... in loss revenue.....

Did you know if you rearrange the letters in ANOTHER UNIVERSE, you get A SHORT IN REVENUE?

[fnordboy]

And I will make them pay.... in loss revenue.....

Did you know if you rearrange the letters in ANOTHER UNIVERSE, you get A SHORT IN REVENUE?

That is too F-ing funny.

You have a lot of time on your hands sitting around waiting for rubber checks huh?

(and no I am not trying to give you another excuse to use your little animated gif )

[Tapp_Darden]

And I will make them pay.... in loss revenue.....

Did you know if you rearrange the letters in ANOTHER UNIVERSE, you get A SHORT IN REVENUE?

In all honistly I'm not going to do more then just remember the names, AU, Comicstore.com, CMI holdings, and of course Ross, and never do buz-ness with again. Also if I find that they are advertizing at another site I will kindly tell the webmaster about Another Universe. I've already wasted enough resourses on them.

Am I angry with them? yes. very much so. But its not my banks fault nor is it VISAs fault. And I guess I can sympithize with the ppl on the other end. Maybe its my downfall, but I don't want to live in a world were I have to yell to get my way.
I should never had paid $115 for a pre-order. I learned the hard way.

Of course this does not help my relationship with my bank. and if they don't take care of it then I will leave for another bank. its simple.

my bank used to be free-checking and interest-checking. but they changed that. I hate when companies change the contract like that.

[starbug]

[quote="Tapp_Darden"] But its not my banks fault nor is it VISAs fault. And I guess I can sympithize with the ppl on the other end. Maybe its my downfall, but I don't want to live in a world were I have to yell to get my way.

quote]

I agree, it isn't their fault. But think of it this way; they are meant to be customer service oriented. The average customer pays VISA and banks a heck of a lot in interest. For this, you get a service. They aren't doing you a favour by giving you credit, or storing your mony - they are making money out of you. In return, they are providing you with a service. For many credit cards, a part of that service is an agreement that they will cover you if you ever suffer a fraud, and laid out money using your card.
If they're not honouring their agreement, they may need to be yelled at.

I know, it isn't the person on the phone's personal fault if they are the first port of call that you get to. But by the time you are speaking to someone high up in management and they still aren't giving you any joy, it is unacceptable.

I hate yelling at people. And I hate living in a world where it's necessary. But sometimes being gentle just doesn't work.

[starbug]

Did you know if you rearrange the letters in ANOTHER UNIVERSE, you get A SHORT IN REVENUE?

[GaryEA]

This is very similar to my own personal experiences with government services like getting a time extension on a student loan.

If you call or write them and ask them for more time, most likely they;ll say no in less than two sentences. There's reasons for that, including the fact that they have a hundred other calls to answer, so brevity is required.

However, if you press the situation and insist on talking with people higher up on the totem pole, you'll get a different story. The conversations are more advanced, they'll ask for paperwork to be faxed or mailed, there will be follow-up calls.

So if the person on the other end of the phone bluntly says that you're beyond the 60 day policy without asking for more info, demand on talking to a superior in that department, and that you will continue to pursue this because you feel that you have been defrauded.

-g

[Tapp_Darden]

this is the only response from my bank.

In order to charge back a transaction for a fraudulent mail/telephone order, the VISA time limit is 120 calendar days from the central processing date of the presentment. The central processing date of the charge in question was 5/30/02. This is the VISA operating regulation, not a bank policy.

Thats the only think I get from them.

I was sure the 120 days was from when the transaction ended. I.E. when AU was going to ship the DVD set.

Anyway. I don't like my bank for this and other reasons. and I'm going to pull out. I'm thinking I should wait 'tell this how think with AU gets strighten out. maybe not. I don't know. All I want is my money back. I feel like crying. If it didn't make me so angry I think I would.

Are you sure that the people who got refunds from their banks was not just a write off from the bank?
I'm just a poor collage student. whith almost no money. I really don't think they will care all that much if I leave. I think they would be happy if I do leave them!

Patrick.

[fnordboy]

Anyway. I don't like my bank for this and other reasons. and I'm going to pull out. I'm thinking I should wait 'tell this how think with AU gets strighten out. maybe not. I don't know. All I want is my money back. I feel like crying. If it didn't make me so angry I think I would.

Are you sure that the people who got refunds from their banks was not just a write off from the bank?
I'm just a poor collage student. whith almost no money. I really don't think they will care all that much if I leave. I think they would be happy if I do leave them!

Patrick.

Basically I am in the same boat. I plan on leaving my bank, this being a small reason (a reason nonetheless). You might want to hold out for another 2 months and see if Ross actually makes good on this, if you give them any excuse to cause a problem in your refund then I am sure they will milk it for as long as they can.

Basically I am hoping that Ross sees fixing the overcharges and refunds as a way to take the heat off of him. In his mind if he pays back everyone than he won't have legal problems (which most people will probably back off on after they get their money). So I am feeling a fraction of optimism on his latest "effort". Realistically I don't actually see it happening, but i have a small glimmer of hope.