It's All About Love

Discuss former or new projects of Claire Danes ("Angela Chase") in this forum.
eyeboogers

Post by eyeboogers » Dec 16th 2003, 3:42 pm

Sirsahan, again i'll refrain from presenting my complete defence from the movie until i've rewatched it. Since you asked i saw it when it premiered in denmark would have been either late december or early january of 2003 so it's been a year which i why i need to refreshen my memory. I also bought the dvd when it came out but have been swamped with work since then.(when i said film student earlier i meant writing and directing students so whenever anything actually gets made i get insanely busy, and at other times there'll be months with plenty of dvd watching possibilities.) About the native language thing not being an excuse, let's talk again when your danish is as good as my english.

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Post by sirhansirhan » Dec 16th 2003, 4:40 pm

eyeboogers wrote:Sirsahan, again i'll refrain from presenting my complete defence from the movie until i've rewatched it. Since you asked i saw it when it premiered in denmark would have been either late december or early january of 2003 so it's been a year which i why i need to refreshen my memory. I also bought the dvd when it came out but have been swamped with work since then.(when i said film student earlier i meant writing and directing students so whenever anything actually gets made i get insanely busy, and at other times there'll be months with plenty of dvd watching possibilities.) About the native language thing not being an excuse, let's talk again when your danish is as good as my english.
How about we talk again when you know what you're talking about.

eyeboogers

Post by eyeboogers » Dec 16th 2003, 6:06 pm

Sirsahan, you are one hostile son of a gun, stop being an a**hole and communicate like the intelligent human being i can read between the lines that you are.
While i remember i wanted to address what you wrote about what you referred to as dialouge scripted and delivered in a wooden manner. To that i will say that i completely agree with you but i disagree with you about it being a mistake. It's expertly written,directed and acted, there's a reason for why it's scripted like that and that's the thing here i think you missed the whole point of the movie. This is not a typical tell a story type film this is a mission statement. The filmmakers are commenting on something they feel to be deeply wrong with the way people in generel view the world today, the characters needed to be blank slates personality wise, they needed to be cold, distanced and numb except for the faintest possible spark somewhere behind a ton of emotional debris.Anyways let's table this for now and i'll write something more indept in a week or so.

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Post by Natasha (candygirl) » Dec 16th 2003, 7:43 pm

Okay, let's all calm down. You can discuss the film, but there is no need to get personal. The MSCL forum rules state:
You are allowed to publish your opinion (be it positive or negative) about any topic, but please respect the opinions of other fans. Do not insult or attack other persons on this board.
Calling someone an a**hole (or, alternately, a pretentious a** and a hack) or telling someone that their post is "one of the stupidest...ever" is in violation of the forum rules. You can expess yourselves without being rude to one another.

In addition, although the majority of our members are from North America and the UK, this IS an international forum so keep in mind that not every post will contain perfect spelling or grammar (even by native English speakers).
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Post by sirhansirhan » Dec 17th 2003, 5:21 am

eyeboogers wrote:Sirsahan, you are one hostile son of a gun, stop being an a**hole and communicate like the intelligent human being i can read between the lines that you are.
While i remember i wanted to address what you wrote about what you referred to as dialouge scripted and delivered in a wooden manner. To that i will say that i completely agree with you but i disagree with you about it being a mistake. It's expertly written,directed and acted, there's a reason for why it's scripted like that and that's the thing here i think you missed the whole point of the movie. This is not a typical tell a story type film this is a mission statement. The filmmakers are commenting on something they feel to be deeply wrong with the way people in generel view the world today, the characters needed to be blank slates personality wise, they needed to be cold, distanced and numb except for the faintest possible spark somewhere behind a ton of emotional debris.Anyways let's table this for now and i'll write something more indept in a week or so.
Your point that the bad script and wooden delivery being intentional is an interesting conceit. I have all the faith in the world that Vinterberg knows what he's doing, and what you say is consistent with his Dogme mentalities, so perhaps you've got me there. I'm not admitting defeat here, exactly, but it does make me want to see the movie again to see if I agree with you, and considering how much it annoyed me the first time, making me want to see it again is quite a feat.

Speaking of which, where'd you get the DVD? I looked around on http://www.amazon.de and http://www.pokerindustries.com, but to no avail.

I'm assuming that you are Danish; correct me if I'm wrong. At the London Film Festival this year, the press and the festival coordinators made a big fuss about the fact that they had six Danish films in the festival. Of these six, I thought that Christoffer Boe's Reconstruction was by far the best. Did you happen to catch that one? The other five, if you're curious, were Dogville (which was also very good), Wilbur (Wants to Kill Himself), Arven, Someone Like Hodder, and, of course, It's All About Love.

And I do not at all want to go around offending everyone in the forum, especially the moderators (for obvious reasons), but I think that the post from Candygirl directly above this one is far more inappropriate than anything that eyeboogers has written thus far.

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Post by Sascha (sab) » Dec 17th 2003, 6:38 am

sirhansirhan wrote:And I do not at all want to go around offending everyone in the forum, especially the moderators (for obvious reasons), but I think that the post from Candygirl directly above this one is far more inappropriate than anything that eyeboogers has written thus far.
Okay, you lost me there. Candygirl pointed out our forums rules and we clearly state there that insultings are not acceptable. Her posting was the voice of reason in this thread which seemed to get out of hand - so her posting was more than appropriate. Even if eyeboogers didn't intend to be rude and just wanted to push your buttons by using the word "a**hole" and calling you a "hostile son of a gun" - we just don't accept this kind of aggressive tone in this forum. Sooner or later it will lead to misunderstandings and we're stuck in a flame war. This is not about being perfectly "political correct" in every sentence - you are all free to voice and defend your opinions, but please do this in a more civil tone.
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Post by sirhansirhan » Dec 17th 2003, 5:00 pm

Sascha (sab) wrote:Okay, you lost me there. Candygirl pointed out our forums rules and we clearly state there that insultings are not acceptable. Her posting was the voice of reason in this thread which seemed to get out of hand - so her posting was more than appropriate. Even if eyeboogers didn't intend to be rude and just wanted to push your buttons by using the word "a**hole" and calling you a "hostile son of a gun" - we just don't accept this kind of aggressive tone in this forum. Sooner or later it will lead to misunderstandings and we're stuck in a flame war. This is not about being perfectly "political correct" in every sentence - you are all free to voice and defend your opinions, but please do this in a more civil tone.
I'll clarify:

Both eyeboogers and I have avoided using the seven words that you can't say on television. This is a forum regarding a television program; I do not at all find it offensive to say "ass" or "asshole," even if it used derogatorily, and even if it is directed at me. I am acting like an asshole, and eyeboogers did come off as a pretentious ass and a hack, at least in the first post. However, via our near-constant jabs at each others' respective credibilities, I know that I have seen eyeboogers' point where I likely would not have before, and hopefully he (she?) would say the same about me. And to say that this mutual learning could have been accomplished without the personal attacks is weak; no one tells Candygirl to not be perky, and no one should tell me to not be antagonistic.

Also, I'm sorry, but incorrect spelling and grammar is usually a matter of stupidity and/or ignorance, not of international status.

eyeboogers

Post by eyeboogers » Dec 17th 2003, 5:29 pm

I haven't had a chance to see any other danish films this year besides "I.A.A.L" i currently study in prague and only got to see that one cause i was back home on christmas break. I ordered the dvd from denmark though where it came out this fall. If anyone is interested i believe this site has international shipping:
http://www.laserdisken.dk/html/visvare. ... 7926993197

It has pretty nice extras for a one disc release (30 min making of which is not a press kit for once, directors(and i think d.p's) commentary and various little interviews, trailers etc.

As for the four letter words, i used them somewhat in jest(at least the son of a.. one anyway) cause i felt that the intial response from sirsahan was making it personal more than it was discussing the movie, and now we've managed to do that so it's all good.

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Post by fnordboy » Dec 17th 2003, 6:31 pm

eyeboogers wrote:If anyone is interested i believe this site has international shipping:
http://www.laserdisken.dk/html/visvare. ... 7926993197
I am almost positive that this place does in fact do international shipping. I think this is the etailer that people (in america) have been using to order Lars von Trier's Dogville that was just released over there. (BTW supposedly a great release, I personally may be holding out for the Korean release).

Of course, if anyone orders it realize that it is Region 2 and PAL so depending on where you are living and what equipment you have it may or may not be playable.

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Post by GaryEA » Dec 17th 2003, 7:17 pm

And to say that this mutual learning could have been accomplished without the personal attacks is weak; no one tells Candygirl to not be perky, and no one should tell me to not be antagonistic.
Are you being antogonistic just for kicks, because you just insulted Candygirl again, and told the owner of this forum that the rules do not apply to you?

Gary
(edited for spelling)

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Post by Nothingman » Dec 17th 2003, 7:58 pm

I have kept out of this argument because I don’t have any knowledge of this movie and I don’t care to involve myself in one with so many personal attacks. However, I do feel the need to support our moderators on this one for several reasons.
1. They do and outstanding job donating their time to this site and I am very grateful for that.
2. I agree with their concerns.
3. I consider them my friends, and care about the community of people that make up this forum.

Please re-read what Sascha wrote:
…we just don't accept this kind of aggressive tone in this forum. Sooner or later it will lead to misunderstandings and we're stuck in a flame war.
This is not about the word “ass” or foul language, though those prohibited for obvious reasons. The objection here is to the personal attacks. There is nothing wrong with being passionate or enthusiastic about a topic, but there is no need to attack someone personally. No one’s credibility is on trial here. In this forum your credibility comes from your ability to formulate a good argument, research, and debunk other’s arguments (not others, that’s the key). Whether you are a film student or an auto mechanic, it doesn’t matter here. The important thing is can you back up your premises with fact and reason?
And to say that this mutual learning could have been accomplished without the personal attacks is weak
I fail to see how personal attacks did anything but take this “mutual learning” off track. I believe a personal attack only inhibits someone’s ability to objectively evaluate your argument. Plus, I think you discredit yourself when you have to resort to insults to try and “win” that argument. If being an antagonist is your personality, fine, use it to challenge others to debunk your arguments. But there is no need to badger them into an exchange by attacking who they are.

Lastly, debunking someone’s credibility due to spelling areas is not needed for the reasons I stated regarding credibility above. These posts are not published papers, and spelling is rather irrelevant providing the message is clear. What is said is far more important than any small discrepancies in how it is said. It may annoy you, but learn to live it.
"To come to your senses, you must first go out of your mind." - Alan Watts

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Post by sirhansirhan » Dec 18th 2003, 1:07 am

GaryEA wrote:
And to say that this mutual learning could have been accomplished without the personal attacks is weak; no one tells Candygirl to not be perky, and no one should tell me to not be antagonistic.
Are you being antogonistic just for kicks, because you just insulted Candygirl again, and told the owner of this forum that the rules do not apply to you?

Gary
(edited for spelling)
Wait, where was I when I insulted Candygirl (and more than once, no less)? Is calling someone perky an insult? I don't think so.

I am not saying that the rules don't apply to me. I am saying that the rules don't apply to this. The exchange that eyeboogers and I had was healthy, and there isn't any need to tell us that we're doing it wrong.

I am also not being antagonistic for "kicks," I'm just antagonistic by nature.
Nothingman wrote:I have kept out of this argument because I don’t have any knowledge of this movie and I don’t care to involve myself in one with so many personal attacks. However, I do feel the need to support our moderators on this one for several reasons.
1. They do and outstanding job donating their time to this site and I am very grateful for that.
2. I agree with their concerns.
3. I consider them my friends, and care about the community of people that make up this forum.

Please re-read what Sascha wrote:
…we just don't accept this kind of aggressive tone in this forum. Sooner or later it will lead to misunderstandings and we're stuck in a flame war.

This is not about the word “ass” or foul language, though those prohibited for obvious reasons. The objection here is to the personal attacks. There is nothing wrong with being passionate or enthusiastic about a topic, but there is no need to attack someone personally. No one’s credibility is on trial here. In this forum your credibility comes from your ability to formulate a good argument, research, and debunk other’s arguments (not others, that’s the key). Whether you are a film student or an auto mechanic, it doesn’t matter here. The important thing is can you back up your premises with fact and reason?
And to say that this mutual learning could have been accomplished without the personal attacks is weak

I fail to see how personal attacks did anything but take this “mutual learning” off track. I believe a personal attack only inhibits someone’s ability to objectively evaluate your argument. Plus, I think you discredit yourself when you have to resort to insults to try and “win” that argument. If being an antagonist is your personality, fine, use it to challenge others to debunk your arguments. But there is no need to badger them into an exchange by attacking who they are.

Lastly, debunking someone’s credibility due to spelling areas is not needed for the reasons I stated regarding credibility above. These posts are not published papers, and spelling is rather irrelevant providing the message is clear. What is said is far more important than any small discrepancies in how it is said. It may annoy you, but learn to live it.
Why do so many people feel it necessary to defend the poor readers of this forum from personal attacks, when only eyeboogers and myself were actually personally attacked, and neither of us seem to care? We can take care of ourselves. Thanks anyway, Mom and Dad.

You are not the only one who appreciates this website and the work that the moderators put into it, Nothingman, not to mention the fact that you consider many members of the forum your friends (granted, you're several hundred posts ahead of me in the relationship). I think the website is fantastic and the forum is one of the least boring I've ever seen. Furthermore, Candygirl has personally helped me out with a number of things on a number of occasions, for which I am extremely grateful. All of this doesn't mean that I'm going to roll over when something arises that I disagree with, though. What's more, I'm not going to be made to feel guilty for standing up what I believe in. You don't like insults? Too bad. I'm an insulting guy. It's actually been toned down considerably for this forum in the first place (my favorite words are those that people find the most offensive), and I don't think that I should have to tone it down any more.

By the way, what are the "obvious reasons" why foul language is prohibited?

I didn't resort to insults to try and "win" the argument, either. I wrote responses that were centered around valid arguments, and they were laced with insults, because this tends to be my method of communication. No one wins arguments via insults. I know this as well as anyone.

Finally, while these posts are indeed not published papers (far from it, mosy of the time), inattention to spelling is lazy and stupid. The combination of emails, instant messaging, and forums such as these seems to have given everyone around the world an excuse to let spelling, punctuation, and grammar go by the wayside. I find this annoying as hell. You think my tendency to insult people discredits my arguments; that's fair. I think that bad spelling discredits arguments; that's also fair. The only difference is that all I can do to calm myself on the subject is to encourage people to pay more attention to their spelling, while those who find my insults offensive try to bully me into changing my arguing style, because they are moderators, and somehow I am supposed to believe that this makes their opinions the be-all, end-all.

I'll leave you fine people with a growingly relevant quote:

"We have a difference in opinion. Fine. But you think you should be in the position of deciding because you have a printing press and I don't." -Vic Racine

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Post by GaryEA » Dec 18th 2003, 3:23 am

Enough.

There was a reason why forum rules were cited, sirhansirhan, and you were involved. It applied to you and the debate you were involved in with eyeboogers. End of story. If you don't like it, or can't grasp that, tough. This forum isn't a police state, and we encourage debate, but at the same time, this isn't a playground where you get to push people's buttons and talk back to mods or administrators. Nobody seems to have a problem with that except for you.

Your inability to understand and respect the wishes of the mod team, who had nothing but polite and honest concerns when this started, have done nothing but show that, right now, you could care less about respecting this site, the team that helps to bring it to over a thousand people, or how your words might affect those people.

End of debate. This thread is closed.

Gary

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