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Why Brian ends up with Angela

Posted: Nov 19th 2002, 2:59 am
by Calhoun07
I know there is already a poll posted of who should wind up with her, but I wanted to start a new thread since I wanted to go a tad more in depth and discuss character arcs and all.

After watching the full series, it's plain as day that Angela winds up with Brian. The "so-called life" of Angela is paraell with her mother's life. We learn that Angela's mom was probably more like Angela when she was younger than she would like Angela to believe, and two telling clues are when she talks about how she had a friend just like Rayanne, and also when she talks about Tony. Tony is a type of Jordan, and this is made evident as day when Graham calls Patty to see if Tony ever showed up, and she made like he did and things were "just like old times" because Patty saw so much of Tony in Jordan.

Now, Brian is obviously a type of Graham. Clues I point to are the times Graham's eyes wander to other ladies, but he stays true and faithful to his wife, and he never crosses that line. Brian's eyes wandered to Delia and to Rayanne, and to Sharon, but he never strayed from his love and devotion to Angela, and as Graham always used his love for Patty as his cornerstone and kept coming back to her, so does Brian keep Angela as his cornerstone and keeps going back to her.

Going back early into the series, Patty discusses how she didn't really notice Graham in school. We find out later because she was in love with this Tony, the type of Jordan. However, she came to see Graham's affections for her and realized that she too loved him, and they wound up together.

Back to Jordan: he is not only a type of Tony, but also a type of Nick Driscoll. We see in the Halloween episode where Angela thinks she sees Nick on the stairs and it turns out to be Jordan, and when she encounters Nick later on in her dream or whatever it was, he acts like Jordan with his "whatever" attitude. And Nick's end wasn't met very well, nor do I think that points to Jordan being a lasting person in Angela's life.

For the arc of these characters to make sense, Angela has to end up with Brian. It's pointed to more than once that Jordan is just a passing phase in her life, but it's Brian that is the cornerstone of her heart, and she of his heart, and also keep in mind that girls always go for guys who are like their dads. I suspect that Graham was quite a bit like Brian when he was younger, and that is why he likes to have Brian over at the house so much.

Also consider how much more Angela fights with Brian. When Patty is wondering if Graham might be cheating, she wonders if he is fighting with Hallie, for where there are strong arguments, there is passion. There is more passion between Angela and Brian. Angela feels passion for Jordan, but he's alwasy dissing her with his "whatever" attitude. And I do not see that Angela's passion for Jordan is stronger than her passion for Brian. There is more passion in her arguments and fights with Brian.

At any rate, that's my view on things.

another point

Posted: Nov 20th 2002, 2:39 pm
by just-likeKrakow
I'll have to say these were all very good points I hadn't considered before, though I've always felt that Brian and Angela were more suited for one another.

Especially the comparisons between Jordan and Tony...Patty is rejected by Tony on the last episode with his half-ass reason of why he can't make it over, a lot like all the times Angela was rejected and disappointed by Jordan.

I just recently re-watched Strangers in the House where another good example is presented.

Angela walks in on Brian and Sharon laughing in her bedroom. It's obvious that Brian is trying to be there for Sharon, cheer her up in her time of need. I think it throws Angela off that Brian's company is both needed and wanted by someone, and he seems to be pretty good at making Sharon feel better. He is both attentive and caring.
Angela wants this as well. At this point she doesn't want it from Brian though, but from Jordan. Angela doesn't have the serious problem of having her father in the hospital but she still feels bad, confused and needs comfort. That is when she approaches Jordan under the bleachers with tears in her eyes. I think she almost believes Jordan will be to her what Brian is for Sharon...but not so. She has to physically pry an embrace from him and even then it isn't genuine or long-lived.

I think this is what leads to the concluding conversation between Brian and Angela. Brian basically admits that he knows Sharon didn't need him specifically but anyone to lean on. Angela follows that up by slowly and seriously confessing to Brian that is doesn't work with just anyone (as in her rejected attempt at receiving comfort from Jordan). Brian was wanted and needed by Sharon for specific ways that he is....ways in which Angela is ready to admit Brian embodies.....ways Angela will later discover she both wants and needs as well.

Posted: Nov 22nd 2002, 11:59 am
by katy
I have spent the last couple days catching up on some of the older posts on this site, and I thought the following might be of interest since they relate to the whole Jordan vs. Brian debate. For now I will simply post the URLs, but I will most likely come back and post my thoughts on the matter some time next week...still formulating a response in my head...

Does anybody like Jordan Catalano?
New Topic: Could Brian and Angela ever hit is off as a co

Posted: Nov 22nd 2002, 5:25 pm
by Guest
That was some interesting points you made. I think she would have probably ended up with Brian also because: He knows and cares alot about her. On the last show Angela looks hesitant to go with Jordan, she looks at Brian with longing eyes. Strangely Jordan finally has some real feelings for Angela, I think he learns to respect her.[colo

Posted: Nov 22nd 2002, 5:30 pm
by Megs
This is an excellent post. I have no other comment, other than that. :lol:

After I read this, I watched a few more episodes, and I can really see what you are saying. It changed how I perceive things on the show. Pretty cool. Thanks for this post!!

Posted: Nov 30th 2002, 8:39 pm
by Guest
I think you are all wrong about the Graham/ Brain parallels. I think a very direct and obvious point to who Jordan is like would be in the "Pressure" episode when Jordan comes to the door and graham answers and at the saem time they both rub the back of there heads in the same way. Also Brian is way too smart to be a younger version of Graham. And lastly, both Graham and Jordan use the same line in the episode "Life of Brian," "What ever happens.....happens." jordan says it to angela and graham to brian.

Case Closed :-P

Posted: Nov 30th 2002, 9:07 pm
by Natasha (candygirl)
And then Brian says it to Angela. It's like the Circle of Life. :wink:

Posted: May 21st 2003, 12:13 am
by lithiumkat
hmm, maybe and maybe not, of course i'm a fan of the "brian/angela" idea, even though I didn't used to be, all it took was after I got the dvds and first saw the last ep, I've always wanted them to be together, but going on about all the paralells and angela being like her mother, Graham is like a combination, someone in between Brian and Jordan, I think that's the thing, for Angela, Brian and Jordan represent to halves of the one person she really yearns and desires for.

Like for instance there are a lot of ways that Graham Parallels to Jordan more so than Brian. Like what about in Angelas dream after "the betrayal" happened. Where Graham and Jordan are both walking away from her in the flannel and look back, completely parallel, or what about the idea that she has felt that they have both let her down to some degree (Grahams flirting with affairs, and Jordans sleeping with Rayanne) and there is more, but I can't think right off hand, But I mean, It's like you wonder if there was another guy that Patty went to school with, Tony like Jordan, another guy like Brian and then Graham, someone she never knew but was the perfect blend between to two, who knows, or maybe he was like Brian but as time went by he became a little more like Jordan and kind of had both aspects.

I don't know but I *had* to bring up the parallel between Graham and Jordan in Angelas dream, I know there are more things well ah hah for instance about Patty signing Graham up for the cooking class even though Graham protested and she did it without his permission because he wouldnt take the effort to do something like that on his own, and once it was going he was actually happy about it and the same, like exactly, with Angela and Jordan and the tutoring.

Or for instance how they are both so vague and tend to kind of not talk about things sometimes. We both know that sure as hell isn't Brian, he babbles and tries to say fifty things at onc time "hey brian, could you like-pick a sentence and go with it?!" lol. anyway, just my input, sorry to ressurect yet ANOTHER old thread, I keep doing that.

Posted: Oct 24th 2003, 10:06 am
by Hunee
I think that Angela is more like her mother then any other characters that compare... Angela and Patty seem to go through the same things in there relationships with there friends and lovers... I mean in the long run I think that patty and angela understand eachother more then they want to admit but I dont think that the characters who are alike have anything to do with how the story will end up going... I think that regardless of knowing the truth about the letter or not Angela having the truth of how brian feels is more important... I mean in the pilot you can see when they are in the street how sad he feels for when he was hurting her feelings before she got in the car and she wouldnt let him apalogize and it was almost like a full circle because when they were having a heart to heart again she got into Jordans car and drove away... I think that Brian regardless of having such strong feelings for Angela would rather see her happy then tell her the truth... like when he wrote in the letter the truth is much more then a letter can even say... I dont know if Brian would ever end up with Angela on a romantic level but just how Brian says those words to her at the end... all that matters to the person who wrote that letter is if you are happy... he is just such a beautiful person... he would rather see her happy then tell her the truth... that is just so beautiful

Posted: Oct 26th 2003, 12:29 am
by Frances Farmer
She'll either end up with Brian or someone else, can you honestly see Angela married with Jordan Catalano?

Posted: Oct 26th 2003, 12:58 am
by Natasha (candygirl)
Well, you are basing that statement on two assumptions:

(1) Jordan is wrong for Angela
(2) people never marry the wrong person

I don't know if Jordan is the right person for Angela, but I do know that plenty of people end up with the wrong person. As Buffy says, "Love makes you do the wacky." I've seen enough episodes of Jerry Springer to know that's true!

Posted: Oct 26th 2003, 4:35 am
by Guest
candygirl wrote:Well, you are basing that statement on two assumptions:

(1) Jordan is wrong for Angela
(2) people never marry the wrong person

I don't know if Jordan is the right person for Angela, but I do know that plenty of people end up with the wrong person. As Buffy says, "Love makes you do the wacky." I've seen enough episodes of Jerry Springer to know that's true!
And we also have divorce statistics to prove it.

About Angela and Jordan and whether he's wrong for her or not.I think that's extremely difficult to say.First of all,they are so young and they need to gow up.Secondly,people evolve and change( believe it or not, sometimes even for the better) and third( and most important) we are nobody to say who'll end up with who or who's right for somebody.
But,IMHO, I don't think Angela could ever end up with the "wrong" person..

Posted: Oct 26th 2003, 9:59 pm
by Frances Farmer
Thats a good point except Angela isn't that type of girl. She methodically, obsessively, on big decisions, like whether she should have sex or not, and then decides not to. She does do some things impulsively, dieing her hair, quitting the yearbook, so I don't know but I see Jordan as just this thing in her life, that is there and then after high school is done is gone.

What is with everyone and Brian?

Posted: Oct 31st 2003, 5:27 pm
by Jody Barsch
While I have never entertained the thought that Angela and Jordan are heading for a long-lasting and rewarding relationship when they drive away in his car at the end of "In Dreams," there is NO evidence supporting people's predictions that Angela would choose Brian. She has never liked him (that way), and while she does speak to him with tenderness at times, I don't think that just because she knows he likes her, she will suddenly decide that she likes him. First, even though she claims to be ignorant of his feelings for her, she isn't, she continually changes the subject every time he starts to tell her, and anyone who has lived through this(being liked by a friend that you have no interest in, you are aware of, but its just easier not to be). Besides, Angela and Brian, besides reading alot of the same books, and have VERY similar speech patterns, really do not have all that much in common, it isn't like they're a perfect match in answer to the somewhat mismatch of Jordan and Angela. In response the argument that Angela is following Patty's love cycle- Tony Poole to Graham, I do agree that even Angela herself is aware that she will get over Jordan, that he won't always"be the one," but whay does that automatically lead to Brian Krakow??? Just beacuse Brian and Jordan are the two suitors during her sophomoreyear in high school, this does not mean that she has to choose between one or the other. Also, if Angela really is following Patty's journey (which she is not, Patty had sex in high school, Angela has not) Angela will meet lots of guys in her life, mainly in college.

It just seems like the majority of the contributors to this site are big Brian fans, and while I like Brian, (The moment I am most proud of him is when he says, "So is that like a problem that youre having" to Angela and "I'm not sure" to Jordan in "Pressure") I dont see anything in the show indicating that Angela will ever end up with Brian. She might not be with Jordan for long, but that does not necessitate that she gets with Brian.

Posted: Oct 31st 2003, 5:37 pm
by Jody Barsch
"Now, Brian is obviously a type of Graham. "

No, Jordan is Graham. When Jordan picks Angela up in "Pressure" Graham and Jordan both hold their arms to their heads the same way, so much so that it freaks them out and they both put their hands down. Also, in "Life of Brian" Jordan and Graham both say "Whatever happens, happens" Brian hears Graham say this and copies him, but Graham and Jordan both thought of it on their own. Plus, they are both super sexy!! Brian Krakow is many things, but he is not sexy. Graham and Jordan both have a difficult time being exactly what the Chase women want them to be, Graham recognizes this before he even knows about Jordan when he tells Angela that boys her age don't always know how to be what she wants them to be. Even though Graham was socially more like Brian when he was in High school, at this point in his life, he is more like Jordan -- the girls/women love them.